[SURBL-Discuss] Re[2]: More whitelist.cf

List Mail User track at Plectere.com
Sun Jun 12 04:50:37 CEST 2005

>Hi Paul,
>What is their hat color please?
>Jeff C.
>Don't harm innocent bystanders.
>Discuss mailing list
>Discuss at lists.surbl.org

	I'm pretty sure that 1&1 is a definite "white hat", just so large
that like any large ISP (at least most without zero-tolerance policies),
they get abused from time to time - actually so large, it a not uncommon.
I'm not sure how large, but their presence in Europe seems to be almost
on the order of a "Earthlink" or certainly larger than "Lycos" mail or
other second tier providers - I liken them to RoadRunner, large with
more customers than they can support well, and overly slow to act (but
they do act).  It does seem that abuse is more common for 1and1 than the
European domains (1und1.tld, oneandone.tld seems mostly corporate and large
customers - I haven't seen more than a very few cases of "questionable"
emails from oneandone - but a lot of forgeries).  I simply suspect that
whitelisting them might be like whitelisting any particular address from
Yahoo! - not something I would trust without a statement that they check
and/or reserve that address for their own use only (i.e. no customer could
use it).  Also, note that the most common form of abuse I have seen is the
use of "dropboxes" at 1&1, not mailings from their network (just like for

	They definitely do respond to complaints, but more slowly than I
would like, and often there seems to be a language barrier (which is rare
among the large multi-nationals which I have dealt with).

	Possible someone from Germany has further opinions and/or data
to be shared.  (Please, please - somebody from Germany speak up.)

	I would not put them in with t-dialin.net/t-online.de, who I
would call "grey" - i.e. most customers are average people, but they
make no attempt to act upon complaints (and are abused constantly -
almost daily even for a small site like mine).

	Paul Shupak
	track at plectere.com

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