- Discuss - Mailman 3

Re: [SURBL-Discuss] Forge SURBL mail from gfi.com, just minutes ago.
by List Mail User 08 Apr '05

08 Apr '05

>... > >Hi! > >> If they are legitimate, I certainly wouldn't want to buy any anti-virus >> or anti-spam software from these people! >> >> They are running an open relay: >> >> % telnet mailgate.gfi.com 25 >> Trying 80.85.99.13... >> Connected to mailgate.gfi.com. >> Escape character is '^]'. >> 220 mailgate.gfi.com Microsoft ESMTP MAIL Service, Version: 6.0.3790.1830 ready at Fri, 8 Apr 2005 07:43:44 +0200 >> helo plectere.com >> 250 mailgate.gfi.com Hello [64.32.188.109] >> mail from: <> >> 250 2.1.0 <>....Sender OK >> rcpt to: <test(a)plectere.com> >> 250 2.1.5 test(a)plectere.com >> quit >> 221 2.0.0 mailgate.gfi.com Service closing transmission channel >> Connection closed by foreign host. > >gfi.com, the same gfi.com thats selling mail security products? >One word: Amazing. > >550 5.7.1 Unable to relay for ... > >Just checked, and it seems they closed it allready. > >Bye, >Raymond. > Raymond, Very nice apology from David Vella late last night (or early this morning, depending on your point of view ): >... >Subject: RE: [SURBL-Discuss] Forge SURBL mail from gfi.com, just minutes ago. >Date: Fri, 8 Apr 2005 09:06:25 +0200 >... >From: "David Vella" <david(a)gfi.com> >To: "SURBL Discussion list" <discuss(a)lists.surbl.org> >... >Hi, > >Sorry for this. I am the GFI MailEssentials/MailSecurity/MailArchiver >product manager and I am a list subscriber because I like the SURBL >concept. The reason of these emails seems to be because yesterday our >network administrator installed a new email relay server (named >passthrough) and I believe that he has mis-configured it. I sent him >all this info so that he will look into it. > >I will make sure that this is fixed immediately. > >regards, > >David Vella - GFI Software Ltd. - www.gfi.com >Messaging, Content Security & Network security software >GFI: FAXmaker - LANguard - MailSecurity - DownloadSecurity > >... >[snipped - mostly a copy of one of my mesages] Now we just have to help them off of the blacklists they got on last night (rfci.{whois,postmaster,abuse}) and they were already on L2 SPEWS. It seems that while the evidence for the "whois" listing, was correct, it was actually "insufficient" - San Gwann is not a "city", but it is a valid postal station in Malta (and I have learned, that similar situations also occur in some North African countries), so they can get off of the "rfci.whois" list with an email to rfci. They did bounce the postmaster@ and abuse@ messages, so they'll have to add/enable those accounts, then they can get off of those lists quickly too. As to SPEWS, well, someone will have to do the standard beg and plead and suffer abuse on NAMAE (I haven't checked why they were listed there to begin with, so I don't know exactly how much pleading and abuse will be required). Since you already have abuse@ and postmaster@ on the "Cc:" list, we'll quickly see if they still bounce. Paul Shupak track(a)plectere.com

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RE: [SURBL-Discuss] More spams with Zdnet redirector
by Chris Santerre 08 Apr '05

08 Apr '05

>-----Original Message----- >From: Jeff Chan [mailto:jeffc@surbl.org] >Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2005 10:55 PM >To: SURBL Discussion list >Subject: Re: [SURBL-Discuss] More spams with Zdnet redirector > > >On Thursday, April 7, 2005, 12:45:51 PM, Patrik Nilsson wrote: >> At 00:13 2005-04-07 -0700, Jeff Chan wrote: >>>On Wednesday, April 6, 2005, 11:58:31 PM, Nick Askew wrote: >>> > Jeff, >>> >>> > So it seems that there is an obvious loophole in SURBL. >As long as the >>> > spammer uses a legitimate business running a redirector >you will never >>> black >>> > list them (perhaps the spammer could even set up their >own legitimate >>> > redirector). This open redirector discussion for ZDNET >has been open for >>> > several weeks now, they have had more than ample warning. >>> >>> > Nick >>> >>>No, it's not a loophole. Programs like SpamAssassin and >>>SpamCopURI correctly parse some redirection sites like >>>g.msn.com and check the redirected-to site. > > >> That workaround is part of the problem, not part of the solution. > >> If we encourage client implementations to work around the >problem in that >> way, we will always have: > >> 1. Clients that need to be updated with the latest >redirectors, unless we >> provide and encourage implementations to use a constantly >updated online >> source of redirectors. > >> 2. Major redirectors getting included in the special >work-arounds, like >> Google, and smaller ones not getting included. > >> If we believe that open redirectors are bad, we should not solve the >> problem by working around a few major ones that we are >currently aware of. > >> Patrik > >Our solution is to detect and check the big ones, and try >to get all of them to not be open to spammers. > >What's your solution? Blacklisting all open redirectors? >So no one should be able to mention them? Thats EXACTLY what the new gray list will do. --Chris 'If it appears in spam, list it' (I can't take credit for the above tagline. Another nut came up with it before me!)

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RE: [SURBL-Discuss] ZDNet spamity calamity
by Chris Santerre 08 Apr '05

08 Apr '05

>-----Original Message----- >From: SM [mailto:sm@resistor.net] >Sent: Friday, April 08, 2005 1:56 AM >To: SURBL Discussion list >Subject: Re: [SURBL-Discuss] ZDNet spamity calamity > > >At 21:53 07-04-2005, List Mail User wrote: >>P.S. Despite feeling strongly about this, I'm not sure his >personal accounts >>and domains are the proper forum - if shs(a)cnet.com works, it >would seem to >>be "more" appropriate (i.e. this is a work issue, not a >personal or family > >It is inappropriate to use personal accounts and domains for such an >issue. Using such tactics can only antagonize the person. > >Regards, >-sm I completely agree with the above. As much as I want this resolved, I wouldn't use their personal emails. (Although I have done this with spammers!) Now..... LOL at the "Spamity Calamity" subject! I laugh everytime I see that and I think of Carl running thru the cubicles of AOL screaming it! :) --Chris

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SpamAssassin DNS/SURBL bug possibly discovered, fixed
by Jeff Chan 08 Apr '05

08 Apr '05

See: http://bugzilla.spamassassin.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4249 http://bugzilla.spamassassin.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3997 It would be interesting to see if folks could try the patches added to the tickets, try a slow DNS resolution (longer than the timeout of 3 seconds) and see if they can duplicate/eliminate the error. Also if the hypothesis on 4249 is correct, then the problem of mixed up UDP packets may show up on a network analyzer, tcpdump, etc. Jeff C. -- "If it appears in hams, then don't list it."

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Re: [SURBL-Discuss] Forge SURBL mail from gfi.com, just minutes ago.
by List Mail User 08 Apr '05

08 Apr '05

>... > >List Mail User wrote: > > P.S. I refused it, so I don't know what it was. I do know the >> domain registration is false; There is no city named "San Gwann" >> in the country of Malta. > >http://www.holidays-malta.com/locality_info/san_gwann.htm > > Apparently not a "city" but a recognized "village"; I guess it's like living in unincorparated parts of LA. Note the company claims to be "GFI Software Ltd" and sell anti-spam, anit-virus and email products. Did anyone actually receive the email? Was it just directed at me? Another batch of attempts just occurred: Apr 7 22:22:26 mailhub postfix/qmgr[14119]: D6A9C6A44: removed Apr 7 22:22:31 mailhub postfix/smtpd[24110]: connect from mailgate.gfi.com[80.85.99.13] Apr 7 22:22:32 mailhub postfix/smtpd[24110]: NOQUEUE: reject: RCPT from mailgate.gfi.com[80.85.99.13]: 450 <passthrough>: Helo command rejected: Host not found; from=<discuss-bounces(a)lists.surbl.org> to=<track(a)plectere.com> proto=ESMTP helo=<passthrough> Apr 7 22:22:33 mailhub postfix/smtpd[24110]: lost connection after RSET from mailgate.gfi.com[80.85.99.13] Apr 7 22:22:33 mailhub postfix/smtpd[24110]: disconnect from mailgate.gfi.com[80.85.99.13] Apr 7 22:22:33 mailhub postfix/smtpd[24110]: connect from mailgate.gfi.com[80.85.99.13] Apr 7 22:22:34 mailhub postfix/smtpd[24110]: NOQUEUE: reject: RCPT from mailgate.gfi.com[80.85.99.13]: 450 <passthrough>: Helo command rejected: Host not found; from=<discuss-bounces(a)lists.surbl.org> to=<track(a)plectere.com> proto=ESMTP helo=<passthrough> Apr 7 22:22:34 mailhub postfix/smtpd[24110]: lost connection after RSET from mailgate.gfi.com[80.85.99.13] Apr 7 22:22:34 mailhub postfix/smtpd[24110]: disconnect from mailgate.gfi.com[80.85.99.13] Apr 7 22:22:34 mailhub postfix/smtpd[24110]: connect from mailgate.gfi.com[80.85.99.13] Apr 7 22:22:35 mailhub postfix/smtpd[24110]: NOQUEUE: reject: RCPT from mailgate.gfi.com[80.85.99.13]: 450 <passthrough>: Helo command rejected: Host not found; from=<discuss-bounces(a)lists.surbl.org> to=<track(a)plectere.com> proto=ESMTP helo=<passthrough> Apr 7 22:22:36 mailhub postfix/smtpd[24110]: lost connection after RSET from mailgate.gfi.com[80.85.99.13] Apr 7 22:22:36 mailhub postfix/smtpd[24110]: disconnect from mailgate.gfi.com[80.85.99.13] Apr 7 22:22:36 mailhub postfix/smtpd[24110]: connect from mailgate.gfi.com[80.85.99.13] Apr 7 22:22:37 mailhub postfix/smtpd[24110]: NOQUEUE: reject: RCPT from mailgate.gfi.com[80.85.99.13]: 450 <passthrough>: Helo command rejected: Host not found; from=<discuss-bounces(a)lists.surbl.org> to=<track(a)plectere.com> proto=ESMTP helo=<passthrough> Apr 7 22:22:37 mailhub postfix/smtpd[24110]: lost connection after RSET from mailgate.gfi.com[80.85.99.13] Apr 7 22:22:37 mailhub postfix/smtpd[24110]: disconnect from mailgate.gfi.com[80.85.99.13] If they are legitimate, I certainly wouldn't want to buy any anti-virus or anti-spam software from these people! They are running an open relay: % telnet mailgate.gfi.com 25 Trying 80.85.99.13... Connected to mailgate.gfi.com. Escape character is '^]'. 220 mailgate.gfi.com Microsoft ESMTP MAIL Service, Version: 6.0.3790.1830 ready at Fri, 8 Apr 2005 07:43:44 +0200 helo plectere.com 250 mailgate.gfi.com Hello [64.32.188.109] mail from: <> 250 2.1.0 <>....Sender OK rcpt to: <test(a)plectere.com> 250 2.1.5 test(a)plectere.com quit 221 2.0.0 mailgate.gfi.com Service closing transmission channel Connection closed by foreign host. Paul Shupak track(a)plectere.com

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RE: [SURBL-Discuss] Forge SURBL mail from gfi.com, just minutes ago.
by David Vella 08 Apr '05

08 Apr '05

Hi, Sorry for this. I am the GFI MailEssentials/MailSecurity/MailArchiver product manager and I am a list subscriber because I like the SURBL concept. The reason of these emails seems to be because yesterday our network administrator installed a new email relay server (named passthrough) and I believe that he has mis-configured it. I sent him all this info so that he will look into it. I will make sure that this is fixed immediately. regards, David Vella - GFI Software Ltd. - www.gfi.com Messaging, Content Security & Network security software GFI: FAXmaker - LANguard - MailSecurity - DownloadSecurity -----Original Message----- From: discuss-bounces(a)lists.surbl.org [mailto:discuss-bounces@lists.surbl.org] On Behalf Of List Mail User Sent: Friday, April 08, 2005 8:41 AM To: discuss(a)lists.surbl.org; jeffc(a)surbl.org Cc: track(a)plectere.com Subject: Re: [SURBL-Discuss] Forge SURBL mail from gfi.com, just minutes ago. Called and left a polite message on voice mail - not open until tomorrow - Also, the US op. is a sales and tech support location only. It seem almost certain, that they didn't forge your email - but they are operating an open relay and using an illegal hostname for the HELO argument; Good reasons to believe the product is likely fundamentally flawed. Hell, the relay uses the name "passthrough" - certainly looks to be done on purpose. Maybe someone should LART zdnet using the gfi.com relay and point out the equivalence to them that way:) Paul Shupak track(a)plectere.com _______________________________________________ Discuss mailing list Discuss(a)lists.surbl.org http://lists.surbl.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss This mail was checked for viruses by GFI MailSecurity. GFI also develops anti-spam software (GFI MailEssentials), a fax server (GFI FAXmaker), and network security and management software (GFI LANguard) - www.gfi.com

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Re: [SURBL-Discuss] Forge SURBL mail from gfi.com, just minutes ago.
by List Mail User 08 Apr '05

08 Apr '05

Called and left a polite message on voice mail - not open until tomorrow - Also, the US op. is a sales and tech support location only. It seem almost certain, that they didn't forge your email - but they are operating an open relay and using an illegal hostname for the HELO argument; Good reasons to believe the product is likely fundamentally flawed. Hell, the relay uses the name "passthrough" - certainly looks to be done on purpose. Maybe someone should LART zdnet using the gfi.com relay and point out the equivalence to them that way:) Paul Shupak track(a)plectere.com

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RE: [SURBL-Discuss] Forge SURBL mail from gfi.com, just minutes ago.
by Matthew Wilson 08 Apr '05

08 Apr '05

What's even funnier is that GFI just announced yesterday they are building SURBL checking into their anti-spam software (which, by the way, is very widely used on Exchange servers in the USA). http://www.gfi.com/news/en/mes11launch.htm Matthew Wilson, MCSE (2003), MCSA-Messaging Network Administrator matthew(a)boomer.com Boomer Consulting, Inc. 610 Humboldt Manhattan, KS 66502 http://www.boomer.com 1-888-266-6375 x 17 > -----Original Message----- > From: discuss-bounces(a)lists.surbl.org > [mailto:discuss-bounces@lists.surbl.org] On Behalf Of List Mail User > Sent: Friday, April 08, 2005 12:46 AM > To: discuss(a)lists.surbl.org; spamassassin(a)dostech.ca > Cc: track(a)plectere.com; postmaster(a)gfi.com; abuse(a)gfi.com > Subject: Re: [SURBL-Discuss] Forge SURBL mail from gfi.com, > just minutes ago. > > >... > > > >List Mail User wrote: > > > P.S. I refused it, so I don't know what it was. I do know the > >> domain registration is false; There is no city named "San Gwann" > >> in the country of Malta. > > > >http://www.holidays-malta.com/locality_info/san_gwann.htm > > > > > Apparently not a "city" but a recognized "village"; I > guess it's like living in unincorparated parts of LA. Note > the company claims to be "GFI Software Ltd" and sell > anti-spam, anit-virus and email products. > Did anyone actually receive the email? Was it just directed at me? > Another batch of attempts just occurred: > > Apr 7 22:22:26 mailhub postfix/qmgr[14119]: D6A9C6A44: > removed Apr 7 22:22:31 mailhub postfix/smtpd[24110]: connect > from mailgate.gfi.com[80.85.99.13] Apr 7 22:22:32 mailhub > postfix/smtpd[24110]: NOQUEUE: reject: RCPT from > mailgate.gfi.com[80.85.99.13]: 450 <passthrough>: Helo > command rejected: Host not found; > from=<discuss-bounces(a)lists.surbl.org> > to=<track(a)plectere.com> proto=ESMTP helo=<passthrough> Apr 7 > 22:22:33 mailhub postfix/smtpd[24110]: lost connection after > RSET from mailgate.gfi.com[80.85.99.13] Apr 7 22:22:33 > mailhub postfix/smtpd[24110]: disconnect from > mailgate.gfi.com[80.85.99.13] Apr 7 22:22:33 mailhub > postfix/smtpd[24110]: connect from > mailgate.gfi.com[80.85.99.13] Apr 7 22:22:34 mailhub > postfix/smtpd[24110]: NOQUEUE: reject: RCPT from > mailgate.gfi.com[80.85.99.13]: 450 <passthrough>: Helo > command rejected: Host not found; > from=<discuss-bounces(a)lists.surbl.org> > to=<track(a)plectere.com> proto=ESMTP helo=<passthrough> Apr 7 > 22:22:34 mailhub postfix/smtpd[24110]: lost connection after > RSET from mailgate.gfi.com[80.85.99.13] Apr 7 22:22:34 > mailhub postfix/smtpd[24110]: disconnect from > mailgate.gfi.com[80.85.99.13] Apr 7 22:22:34 mailhub > postfix/smtpd[24110]: connect from > mailgate.gfi.com[80.85.99.13] Apr 7 22:22:35 mailhub > postfix/smtpd[24110]: NOQUEUE: reject: RCPT from > mailgate.gfi.com[80.85.99.13]: 450 <passthrough>: Helo > command rejected: Host not found; > from=<discuss-bounces(a)lists.surbl.org> > to=<track(a)plectere.com> proto=ESMTP helo=<passthrough> Apr 7 > 22:22:36 mailhub postfix/smtpd[24110]: lost connection after > RSET from mailgate.gfi.com[80.85.99.13] Apr 7 22:22:36 > mailhub postfix/smtpd[24110]: disconnect from > mailgate.gfi.com[80.85.99.13] Apr 7 22:22:36 mailhub > postfix/smtpd[24110]: connect from > mailgate.gfi.com[80.85.99.13] Apr 7 22:22:37 mailhub > postfix/smtpd[24110]: NOQUEUE: reject: RCPT from > mailgate.gfi.com[80.85.99.13]: 450 <passthrough>: Helo > command rejected: Host not found; > from=<discuss-bounces(a)lists.surbl.org> > to=<track(a)plectere.com> proto=ESMTP helo=<passthrough> Apr 7 > 22:22:37 mailhub postfix/smtpd[24110]: lost connection after > RSET from mailgate.gfi.com[80.85.99.13] Apr 7 22:22:37 > mailhub postfix/smtpd[24110]: disconnect from > mailgate.gfi.com[80.85.99.13] > > > If they are legitimate, I certainly wouldn't want to > buy any anti-virus or anti-spam software from these people! > > They are running an open relay: > > % telnet mailgate.gfi.com 25 > Trying 80.85.99.13... > Connected to mailgate.gfi.com. > Escape character is '^]'. > 220 mailgate.gfi.com Microsoft ESMTP MAIL Service, Version: > 6.0.3790.1830 ready at Fri, 8 Apr 2005 07:43:44 +0200 helo > plectere.com 250 mailgate.gfi.com Hello [64.32.188.109] mail > from: <> 250 2.1.0 <>....Sender OK rcpt to: > <test(a)plectere.com> 250 2.1.5 test(a)plectere.com quit > 221 2.0.0 mailgate.gfi.com Service closing transmission > channel Connection closed by foreign host. > > Paul Shupak > track(a)plectere.com > _______________________________________________ > Discuss mailing list > Discuss(a)lists.surbl.org > http://lists.surbl.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss > > >

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Re: [SURBL-Discuss] ZDNet spamity calamity
by List Mail User 08 Apr '05

08 Apr '05

>... > >See www.oct17.com and www.october17.com for his contact information. > >> -----Original Message----- >>[snipped] Registration data for both domains lists stephen(a)Oct17.com as the "Administrative Contact" email. Paul Shupak track(a)plectere.com P.S. Despite feeling strongly about this, I'm not sure his personal accounts and domains are the proper forum - if shs(a)cnet.com works, it would seem to be "more" appropriate (i.e. this is a work issue, not a personal or family issue). Another reference "Stephen Howard-Sarin Vice President, CNET Networks / shs(a)cnet.com / 415.344.2000". (Note: telephone number works today!)

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More on gfi.com (Re: Delivery Status Notification (Failure))
by List Mail User 08 Apr '05

08 Apr '05

A *really* good anti-spam/email company - an open relay and they bounce mail to both abuse@ and postmaster@. They are also listed in L2 of SPEWS. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Apr 7 22:46:12 2005 From: postmaster(a)gfimalta.com To: track(a)Plectere.com Date: Fri, 8 Apr 2005 07:44:13 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/report; report-type=delivery-status; boundary="9B095B5ADSN=_01C53B8BE76FEABE00007F02MAILFAXSRV.gfima" X-DSNContext: 335a7efd - 4523 - 00000001 - 80040546 Subject: Delivery Status Notification (Failure) X-OriginalArrivalTime: 08 Apr 2005 05:48:27.0402 (UTC) FILETIME=[95FC9EA0:01C53BFE] This is a MIME-formatted message. Portions of this message may be unreadable without a MIME-capable mail program. --9B095B5ADSN=_01C53B8BE76FEABE00007F02MAILFAXSRV.gfima Content-Type: text/plain; charset=unicode-1-1-utf-7 This is an automatically generated Delivery Status Notification. Delivery to the following recipients failed. postmaster(a)gfi.com abuse(a)gfi.com --9B095B5ADSN=_01C53B8BE76FEABE00007F02MAILFAXSRV.gfima Content-Type: message/delivery-status Reporting-MTA: dns;MAILFAXSRV.gfimalta.com Received-From-MTA: dns;mailgate_old.gfi.com Arrival-Date: Fri, 8 Apr 2005 07:44:13 +0200 Final-Recipient: rfc822;postmaster(a)gfi.com Action: failed Status: 5.1.1 Final-Recipient: rfc822;abuse(a)gfi.com Action: failed Status: 5.1.1 --9B095B5ADSN=_01C53B8BE76FEABE00007F02MAILFAXSRV.gfima Content-Type: message/rfc822 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- [snipped] Paul Shupak track(a)plectere.com

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More on gfi.com
by List Mail User 08 Apr '05

08 Apr '05

Their SPF/TXT record lists a bunch of addresses including several from Rackspace (the same people who run the domain spamhaus.net), a few really from Malta, and a few from germany. The emails came from Vodaphone in Malta. Paul Shupak track(a)plectere.com

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Forge SURBL mail from gfi.com, just minutes ago.
by List Mail User 08 Apr '05

08 Apr '05

Did anyone else just see forged mail with a "From:" line of "discuss-bounces(a)lists.surbl.org" coming from the IP 80.85.99.13, machine host name mailgate.gfi.com and using a HELO of "passthrough"? Paul Shupak track(a)plectere.com P.S. I refused it, so I don't know what it was. I do know the domain registration is false; There is no city named "San Gwann" in the country of Malta.

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Re: More spams with Zdnet redirector
by J. Fowler 08 Apr '05

08 Apr '05

I posted to the CNET financial message boards on Yahoo and got this response: http://finance.yahoo.com/q/mb?s=CNET ==== Re: CNet supporting spammers NOT* *Folks, We're aware of the abuse, and are shutting down the URLs as we learn of them. We are NOT supporting spammers or phishers. Stephen Howard-Sarin VP, ZDNet.com ===

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Re: [SURBL-Discuss] Re: More spams with Zdnet redirector
by List Mail User 08 Apr '05

08 Apr '05

>... > >On Thursday, April 7, 2005, 1:11:26 PM, J. Fowler wrote: >> I posted to the CNET financial message boards on Yahoo and got this response: > >> http://finance.yahoo.com/q/mb?s=CNET > >> ==== >> Re: CNet supporting spammers NOT* >> *Folks, > >> We're aware of the abuse, and are shutting down the URLs as we learn of them. We are NOT supporting spammers or phishers. > >> Stephen Howard-Sarin >> VP, ZDNet.com >> === > >Can you LART him with: > > http://www3.surbl.org/redirect.html > >Jeff C. >-- >"If it appears in hams, then don't list it." > >_______________________________________________ >Discuss mailing list >Discuss(a)lists.surbl.org >http://lists.surbl.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss > Old email: Stephen Howard-Sarin <shs(a)cnet.com> Paul Shupak track(a)plectere.com

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Re: [SURBL-Discuss] Re: More spams with Zdnet redirector
by List Mail User 08 Apr '05

08 Apr '05

>... > >I posted to the CNET financial message boards on Yahoo and got this response: > >http://finance.yahoo.com/q/mb?s=CNET > >==== >Re: CNet supporting spammers NOT* >*Folks, > >We're aware of the abuse, and are shutting down the URLs as we learn of them. We are NOT supporting spammers or phishers. > >Stephen Howard-Sarin >VP, ZDNet.com >=== > >_______________________________________________ >Discuss mailing list >Discuss(a)lists.surbl.org >http://lists.surbl.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss > That sounds a lot like "after the first million or so emails are sent we block the redirector for that URL". It seems to be exactly the same as running an open relay and cutting off access *after* someone complains. Now, of course the same spammer can use the site again tomorrow, with a new domain and a $10 investment. The only safe way to operate a redirector is exactly like running a mail server - Only those clients/domains listed *in advance* can be allowed: Anything else is "supporting spammers"! How many of you would run an open SMTP relay and only blacklist a machine or domain *after* you learn about it sending "abusive" emails? (That's probably why he's a VP, not an engineer.) Paul Shupak track(a)plectere.com

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ZDNet spamity calamity
by Matthew Wilson 08 Apr '05

08 Apr '05

See www.oct17.com and www.october17.com for his contact information. > -----Original Message----- > From: discuss-bounces(a)lists.surbl.org > [mailto:discuss-bounces@lists.surbl.org] On Behalf Of Jeff Chan > Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2005 8:40 PM > To: J. Fowler > Cc: discuss(a)lists.surbl.org > Subject: Re: [SURBL-Discuss] Re: More spams with Zdnet redirector > > On Thursday, April 7, 2005, 1:11:26 PM, J. Fowler wrote: > > I posted to the CNET financial message boards on Yahoo and > got this response: > > > http://finance.yahoo.com/q/mb?s=CNET > > > ==== > > Re: CNet supporting spammers NOT* > > *Folks, > > > We're aware of the abuse, and are shutting down the URLs as > we learn of them. We are NOT supporting spammers or phishers. > > > Stephen Howard-Sarin > > VP, ZDNet.com > > === > > Can you LART him with: > > http://www3.surbl.org/redirect.html > > Jeff C. > -- > "If it appears in hams, then don't list it." > > _______________________________________________ > Discuss mailing list > Discuss(a)lists.surbl.org > http://lists.surbl.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss > > >

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RE: [SURBL-Discuss] Re: More spams with Zdnet redirector
by Chris Santerre 08 Apr '05

08 Apr '05

>-----Original Message----- >From: Raymond Dijkxhoorn [mailto:raymond@surbl.org] >Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2005 4:33 PM >To: SURBL Discussion list >Subject: RE: [SURBL-Discuss] Re: More spams with Zdnet redirector > > >Hi! > >>> We're aware of the abuse, and are shutting down the URLs as we >>> learn of them. We are NOT supporting spammers or phishers. > >> If that is the method they want, maybe we could forward them >a few 100k >> domains for them to blacklist? >> >> They will fight a losing battle with this method. > >They could start using SURBL, then its all the same ;) > I believe Jeff had asked them that already. --Chris

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RE: [SURBL-Discuss] Re: More spams with Zdnet redirector
by Chris Santerre 08 Apr '05

08 Apr '05

>-----Original Message----- >From: J. Fowler [mailto:spamtrap@cvip.net] >Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2005 4:11 PM >To: discuss(a)lists.surbl.org >Subject: [SURBL-Discuss] Re: More spams with Zdnet redirector > > >I posted to the CNET financial message boards on Yahoo and got >this response: > >http://finance.yahoo.com/q/mb?s=CNET > >==== >Re: CNet supporting spammers NOT* >*Folks, > >We're aware of the abuse, and are shutting down the URLs as we >learn of them. We are NOT supporting spammers or phishers. If that is the method they want, maybe we could forward them a few 100k domains for them to blacklist? They will fight a losing battle with this method. --Chris

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Leaving SURBL
by Chris Santerre 08 Apr '05

08 Apr '05

Greetings Everyone, As of today, I am leaving SURBL for private reasons. SURBL continues to be one of the best antispam measures. I will be forming my own public URI lists. One black and one gray. But they will not be affiliated with SURBL. (So I'll most likely be begging for mirrors later!) I'll continue to be part of the whitelist group for a while, in case my old submissions need explanation. Consider the new black list to be more aggressive then WS, but striving for the same zero FP rate as WS. Also all domains manually checked. The gray list will be for mainsleeze, and will cause FPs. I'll post more info about the lists after I get some mirrors. Did I mention I need mirrors? :) Thanks, Chris (Needs mirrors) Santerre System Admin and SARE Ninja http://www.rulesemporium.com

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Re: [SURBL-Discuss] More spams with Zdnet redirector
by List Mail User 07 Apr '05

07 Apr '05

>... > >On Wednesday, April 6, 2005, 11:54:56 AM, Patrik Nilsson wrote: >> At 01:26 2005-04-06 -0700, Jeff Chan wrote: >>>Raymond, Paul and others, please LART them. >>> >>>We're not going to blacklist zdnet. > >> It's not zdnet, it's chkpt.zdnet.com. > >> Does chkpt.zdnet.com show up in ham? > >> http://groups-beta.google.com/groups?q=%22chkpt.zdnet.com%22&start=10&scori… > >> Are we still 100% opposed to trying to find a way to include sub-domains in >> surbls? > >> Patrik > >It's possible to list subdomains, but this one chkpt.zdnet.com >would still probably not be appropriate since it probably has >legitimate uses. Also subdomains may not be checked by SURBL >applications. > >Jeff C. >-- >"If it appears in hams, then don't list it." > >_______________________________________________ >Discuss mailing list >Discuss(a)lists.surbl.org >http://lists.surbl.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss > It is actually worse than a subdomain. If it were a simple "static" name, maybe you could list the IP. But it is a CNAME with a five minute TTL, and it *does* seem to change regularly! % dig chkpt.zdnet.com any @ns.cnet.com ; <<>> DiG 9.3.0 <<>> chkpt.zdnet.com any @ns.cnet.com ;; global options: printcmd ;; Got answer: ;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: NOERROR, id: 18416 ;; flags: qr aa rd; QUERY: 1, ANSWER: 1, AUTHORITY: 3, ADDITIONAL: 3 ;; QUESTION SECTION: ;chkpt.zdnet.com. IN ANY ;; ANSWER SECTION: chkpt.zdnet.com. 300 IN CNAME c10-dw-xw-lb.cnet.com. ;; AUTHORITY SECTION: zdnet.com. 86400 IN NS ns.cnet.com. zdnet.com. 86400 IN NS ns2.cnet.com. zdnet.com. 86400 IN NS ns3.cnet.com. ;; ADDITIONAL SECTION: ns.cnet.com. 86400 IN A 216.239.126.10 ns2.cnet.com. 86400 IN A 206.16.0.71 ns3.cnet.com. 86400 IN A 216.239.120.69 ;; Query time: 19 msec ;; SERVER: 216.239.126.10#53(ns.cnet.com) ;; WHEN: Thu Apr 7 07:58:20 2005 ;; MSG SIZE rcvd: 166 % dig c10-dw-xw-lb.cnet.com any @ns.cnet.com ; <<>> DiG 9.3.0 <<>> c10-dw-xw-lb.cnet.com any @ns.cnet.com ;; global options: printcmd ;; Got answer: ;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: NOERROR, id: 46613 ;; flags: qr aa rd; QUERY: 1, ANSWER: 1, AUTHORITY: 3, ADDITIONAL: 3 ;; QUESTION SECTION: ;c10-dw-xw-lb.cnet.com. IN ANY ;; ANSWER SECTION: c10-dw-xw-lb.cnet.com. 300 IN A 216.239.115.143 ;; AUTHORITY SECTION: cnet.com. 86400 IN NS ns.cnet.com. cnet.com. 86400 IN NS ns2.cnet.com. cnet.com. 86400 IN NS ns3.cnet.com. ;; ADDITIONAL SECTION: ns.cnet.com. 86400 IN A 216.239.126.10 ns2.cnet.com. 86400 IN A 206.16.0.71 ns3.cnet.com. 86400 IN A 216.239.120.69 ;; Query time: 20 msec ;; SERVER: 216.239.126.10#53(ns.cnet.com) ;; WHEN: Thu Apr 7 07:58:51 2005 ;; MSG SIZE rcvd: 156 Yesterday (or the day before), it pointed at a different IP. I still think the only effective LART is a short message, and forward the problem email to the CNet editors (but maybe someone else can find a person at CNet to listen - I can't). Meanwhile, If they don't do something soon - I promise when I own cnet.com and zdnet.com, there will not be any redirectors:) Paul Shupak track(a)plectere.com

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Re: [SURBL-Discuss] More spams with Zdnet redirector
by List Mail User 07 Apr '05

07 Apr '05

>From discuss-bounces(a)lists.surbl.org Wed Apr 6 01:34:26 2005 >Date: Wed, 6 Apr 2005 01:26:12 -0700 >From: Jeff Chan <jeffc(a)surbl.org> >X-Mailer: The Bat! (v1.62q) Personal >Organization: SURBL >X-Priority: 3 (Normal) >To: Raymond Dijkxhoorn <raymond(a)surbl.org> >Subject: Re: [SURBL-Discuss] More spams with Zdnet redirector >... >Cc: SURBL Discussion list <discuss(a)lists.surbl.org> >... > >Raymond, Paul and others, please LART them. > >We're not going to blacklist zdnet. > >Jeff C. > >_______________________________________________ >Discuss mailing list >Discuss(a)lists.surbl.org >http://lists.surbl.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss > I spent over an hour today trying to speak to anyone on the editorial staff. I managed to leave two messages, and spoke to two people who were to "much" too busy to talk (they had been expecting other calls). The "Editor", Jeff Pelline, said if I sent him an email, he would "try" to get to it tomorrow; After, well over an hour - I gave up. They had moved buildings and disconnected their old telephone numbers about a year ago, so ten minutes later I "wdprs"'d and "rfci.whois"'d about 8 of their domains - that only took about 7 minutes of my time - now they can spend a few hours cleaning up and maybe then they will "have time" to talk (Note: they already had some listings for bouncing abuse@ & postmaster@ emails - seem they have a history of an overly aggressive "spam" filter" that bounces what appear to be innocuous messages - so I doubt you can discuss "spam" with them by email; And while they have cleared a few entries, they just ignore some of the others). I seriously doubt there is anyone to send a LART to (most of their domains bounce either abuse@, postmaster@ or both or even worse, show the accounts as being over-quota - i.e. nobody reads them). We'll see if the people I left messages for actually return my calls. I've given up on them - they are of the general apparent belief "my time is more valuable than yours". Someone else can burn a few hours on it. I like Raymond's rule - maybe I'll just block them outright - I don't get anything from them commonly, certainly not often (it has been many years since I found the news.com digests to have any value). Paul Shupak track(a)plectere.com P.S. The telephone numbers are "hidden", but anyone who wants to try is welcome: http://news.com.com/2040-1096_3-0.html?tag=ne.ft.si.con All their listed registration contact data is invalid (this is an Internet company)!? P.P.S. The sales department answered consistantly, but them transfered me into an endless hold pattern which seems to hang up after about ten minutes. P.P.P.S. The "Editor-at-large", Michael Kanellos, is the person who writes most often and most recently about spam, but his voice mailbox was full!

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next redir?
by Alex Broens 07 Apr '05

07 Apr '05

Is this new? http://g.msn.com/0MNBUS00/1?http://www.true-offers.com/dip/ Alex

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RE: [SURBL-Discuss] Re: Leaving SURBL
by Chris Santerre 06 Apr '05

06 Apr '05

>-----Original Message----- >From: Frank Ellermann [mailto:nobody@xyzzy.claranet.de] >Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2005 3:55 PM >To: discuss(a)lists.surbl.org >Subject: [SURBL-Discuss] Re: Leaving SURBL > > >Chris Santerre wrote: > >> As of today, I am leaving SURBL for private reasons. > >That's sad, why not do your own thing with your own zone, >but otherwise stay here (= SURBL ML) and share your ideas ? Yeah, I'm going to stay on this mailing list as well. Someones got to bring the funny! > >> they will not be affiliated with SURBL > >If you have an idea which doesn't fit into multi.* you could >still use the existing infrastruture in a cs.surbl.org zone, >in theory. In practice you apparently came to the conclusion >that that's not what you want... Without draggin out the details, I would have liked to work under the surbl.org zone. but ..... > (or that Jeff hates the idea). *cough* --Chris (He said it! I didn't!) :)

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Re: [SURBL-Discuss] More spams with Zdnet redirector
by List Mail User 06 Apr '05

06 Apr '05

>... > >Replying to my own mail, Zdnet finally seems to have taken care of its >redirector. The link >"http://chkpt.zdnet.com/chkpt/howbad/rdx56.info/p/yo" that appeared in >the spam is now not being redirected it shows a message > >"Forbidden to relay request through this server" > >finally they seem to have taken care of this. > > >Rakesh wrote: > >> Guys >> >> Seems Zdnet doesn't bothers about its open redirectors as yet. This is >> a spam that I trapped just 5 mins back. Spammers are enjoying using >> these openredirectors. >> >> Can any one send a reminder to Zdnet of this redirector. >> >> The Spam ....... >> >> Hi, >> >> Wanna get up 4 times in one night, well we've got the answer for you, >> check >> us out at http://chkpt.zdnet.com/chkpt/howbad/rdx56.info/p/yo >> >> > > >-- >Regards, >Rakesh B. Pal >Emergic CleanMail Team. >Netcore Solutions Pvt. Ltd. > >-- >Revolutions do not require corporate support. > > >_______________________________________________ >Discuss mailing list >Discuss(a)lists.surbl.org >http://lists.surbl.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss > I have to repeat, send copies of your spam to the editors They are now applying an proprietary spam filter to the redirector. Try http://chkpt.zdnet.com/chkpt/howbad/www.google.com/ or for the more daring Try http://chkpt.zdnet.com/chkpt/howbad/www.wiurrc.mfdi.beeiturmoi.com/ (drug spam - no porn - no pictures -- but "kiddie porn" at Yahoo! works also) and watch it work. They have stated that they "are providing a service". Until we all trust that their spam filtering is as good as any that anyone of us might do, they are basically an open relay and should be treated as such! Jeff, please reconsider and list them until it is REALLY fixed. As far as I can tell, they only block the sites which they have received specific complaints about. This policy SUCKS. Paul Shupak track(a)plectere.com Closing the door after the animals are already free *does not* count!

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Re: [SURBL-Discuss] More spams with Zdnet redirector
by List Mail User 06 Apr '05

06 Apr '05

>... > >On Tuesday, April 5, 2005, 10:19:27 AM, List User wrote: >> I hate to repeat myself, but... > >> Please, just forward any spam arriving in this fashion to a list of >> the various editors at Cnet. Then, and only then will the problem be addressed. >> Right now they consider this to be a "service" that they offer! > > >> Paul Shupak >> track(a)plectere.com > >I don't think it's right to spam other people. Report them to >their abuse address, the media, slashdot, etc. > >Jeff C. >-- >"If it appears in hams, then don't list it." > >_______________________________________________ >Discuss mailing list >Discuss(a)lists.surbl.org >http://lists.surbl.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss > Jeff, In general, I agree with your statement. Maybe I should have said to send a note, and append the spam. This is I feel a special case, because CNet *is* the media! Sending mail to abuse@, slashdot, etc. will likely be ignored as long as they consider this a service (from a telephone call to them - a low level tech. who "asked" a supervisor, and didn't want to forward me - seem quite bothered by the whole process and left a bad taste in my mouth). It seems that the editors are *exactly* the people to send copies to. I did originally note that I left off the list the names and email addresses of executives as they did not seem appropriate (corporate types are neither the "media" or technical staff - so here we agree on at least part). Beside, if you add a note, you are not spamming them, but merely "informing the media" just as you recommend:) I'll give this more though (I have only gotten one so far). Bye, Paul Shupak track(a)plectere.com

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